Epimemetics: Beyond Susan Blackmore's Third Replicator
Epimemetic Quotable Quotes:
"Go Forth Yet Again and Reach Beyond The Stars . . . '" - Russell Wright, founder of Epimemetic Philosophy
"Das ist nicht nur nicht richtig, es ist nicht einmal falsch!"- Wolfgang Pauli
"It is not only not right, it is not even wrong!" - Wolfgang Pauli
"Truth is not one of the strong selectors for Memes." -Richard Brodie, Virus of the Mind
"Truth is not a strong selector for memes, but Truth is a strong selector for Epimemes. - Russell Wright
"The Less You Know, The More You Believe" - Unknown
The logo for Epimemetics is currently in the developmental phases. It was inspired by the movie Inception created by Christopher Nolan.The fictional model of stacked "illusional" epistemolgies may have cultural value as metaphor in several discipline. Or it may not. We reserve the right to change our mind and any time and delete the logo. In fact we probably will.
Logo meaning discussed below.
Core Axioms and Meme-Plexes of Epimemetics - Introduction and Inspiration Behind Epimemetic Philosophy:
Epimemetic (Experimental) Philosophy started out as a playful joke between two software entrepreneurs. It was inspired by the brilliant (and evolving) work of Susan Blackmore, founder of Memetic Theory. Her work (at the time of this writing) is limited to "The Third Replicator" aka "Temes or Techno-Memes". (See below Epimemetic Replicator Stacking Chart). Also, please do watch Susan's Ted Talk for a full primer. We give full provenance to Susan for inspiring us to transcend the limits of her work on cultural replication called The Meme Machine. Epimemetics is a proposed philosophy of how the human race might participate in the active manifestation of The Fourth Replicator or The Pattern. We also propose that The Fourth Replicator (described as the Pure Cultural Creation Vmeme Container within the system of Spiral Dynamics) - is "something like" the co-creative philosophy/religion of Syntheism suggested by epimemetic hero and philosopher Alexandar Bard, co-author of The Futurica Trilogy. The Futurica Trilogy is probably the most intellectually advanced work of it's kind.
Please see Russell Wright's personal comment about the courage and scientific integrity of Susan Blackmore as demonstrated by her life.
Related Core Axiom:
Alexander Bard - The Futurica Trilogy
Announcement: Could Alexander Bard's new Syntheist project be one of the new "Best Epimemes" of our time? It is possible. We will be providing a full critique as soon as the book is released.
Frank Drake's Equation for the Prediction of the Survival of Sentient Life (Surviving Past the 3rd Replicator):
N = R* fp ne fl fi fc L
N = The number of communicative civilizations
R*= The rate of formation of suitable stars (stars such as our sun) *Note: Does not take into account the possibility of life in non-easrth environments, such as silicon based - you will need separate drake equations for those and a divisible to account for them all.
fp = The fraction of those stars with planets.
ne = The number of Earth-like worlds per planetary system.
fl = The fraction of those Earth-like planets where life actually develops.
fi = The fraction of life sites where intelligence developes. *Note: Wright has expanded the definition of intelligence to mean "recursive consciousness" or self awareness as suggested by VM Ramachandran.
fc = The fraction of communicative planets (those on which electromagnetic communication technology develops). *Note: Does not take into account other mechanisms of communiction and spectrums yet undiscovered.
L = The lifetime and life-span of communicating civilizations.
Definition of Epimeme or Epi-Meme:
Sustainable and/or Evergreen and/or *Recursive Ideas and/or Universal Patterns and Principles that Seldom Change. These patterns, ratios, principles and tautologies are often consistent across multiple disciplines, time periods, cultures, and thought systems.
1. "Epi": a prefix occurring in loanwords from Greek, where it meant “upon,” “on,” “over,” “near,” “at,” “before,” “after” (epigenetics, epicedium; epidermis; epigene; epitome);
Example: "Epi-Genetics" would be "above/beyond genetics". (See The Biology of Belief, by Bruce Lipton)
2. Meme or "memetics":
A Meme is
1. An element of a culture or behavior that may be passed from one individual to another by nongenetic means, especially imitation.
An image, video, etc. that is passed electronically from one Internet user to another.
Also See Russell Wright's wiki page on Memes.
Therefore, Epimemetics means:
"above or beyond or OVER memes (replicated viral ideas) passed digitally, organically, or biologically via variation and naturally occurring selection. (See the Epimemetic Cultural Buoyancy Map Below)
Epimemes are underlying oganizing principles for memes.
Epimemes are principles, patterns and/or organizing constants (fractal attractors) that do not change. Chaos tends to organzie around such "epimemes/certainties" that facilitate a transmutation of suboptimal kludge within any dynamic system. This algorithm as been called nature's "Test for Symmetry" by Bucky Fuller and others. This eternal algorithm allows for the ever-increasing improvement of system design without the aid of mind.
Epimemes are foundational patterns and geometries that allow System Stacking and/or organizing principles such as a fractal attractor. The science of simplicity can only exist because of Stackable Epimemes (. . . or universal organizing principles that do not change). These Epi-memes (including but not limited to Plutonic Solids) are generally used to Construct a Universe or Multiverse. In fact the core mechanism of Universal Darwinism is not some Ugly Godless Thing. As a principle it implies the intrinsic default beauty contained within variation, selection, and replication that manifests Design out of Chaos without the aid of mind. Theodore Schwenk called this Sensitive Chaos.
Caution! When referring to Epimemes, we are not referring to Objects, Things and "Stuff". ("Things" are merely a RESULT of both human Memes and Universal Epimemes.) We are talking about the Principles of Sensitive Chaos that GIVE RISE to self-replicating, recursive, self-aware Patterns, Entities and Systems. Epimemes are the self-embedding patterns and principles that give rise to "Self-Awareness" within ANY type of system, including biological and technological. Your BRAIN, for instance, is the result of one such recursive epimemetic system. (See the required preparatory reading list for Solalign Neurotheology Integration System).
Common Confusion Between Memes and Epimemes:
Memes require "belief" and/or "viral propagation" within a given thought system, in order to survive.
Epimemes do not.
Epimemetics is the science and philosophy of Meta-Belief and Meme-Transcendence:
Epimemes require neither belief nor social propagation in order to be True, Universal, or Sustainable. They also do not REQUIRE evangelism in order to be tautologically factual. Epimemes are immutable laws, patterns and structures that can be recognized in both micro and macro cosmos - much like the generally consistent laws of fluid dynamics and/or hydrodynamic theory. Universal Darwinism is precisely such a fluid and perfect algorithm containing built in self-correcting "improved-design attractors".
Epi-meme Zero (The Core Epimeme): "Size is Profane but Ratio is Profound"
The Core Epimeme is also the organizing principle for the Epimemetic Thought System. It is also similar to "Sensitive Chaos" discussed by Solalign Neurotheology Integration Theory - an Irrational Branch of Epimemetics.
Creedy: Die! Die! Why won't you die?... Why won't you die?
V: Beneath this mask there is more than flesh. Beneath this mask there is an idea, Mr. Creedy, and ideas are bulletproof.
- V is for Vendetta
Epimemetics - The Science of Essential Ideas and Values that Don't Change
Relevant Quote: "Wherever on earth did you get THAT idea?"
Relevant Quote: "Don't believe everything you think, and don't think everything you believe."
Epimemtics is the science and philosophy of Meme-Transcendence.
The philosophy of Epimemetics was originally synthesized in 2011 by technologist, inventor and neurotheologist Russell Wright of Epimemetics LLC and Theme Zoom LLC. Epimemetics is currently in an early viral state of widespread cultural replication. Borrowed from the concept of Epigenetics, Epimemetics deals with ideas (memes) instead of genes and includes social dynamics and other disciplines as environmental factors contributing to the inception, perpetuaton and survival of both good and bad ideas.
In summary, Epimemetics is the scientific methodology of studying and consciously re-engineering "ideas about ideas' (Meta-Memes) and "beliefs about beliefs" (Meta-Beliefs). The ultimate goal is to transform and limit the power of negative replicators by taking personal and cultural responsibility for them as individuals.
Virus of the Mind: The Best "Meme" Primer for Beginners
Epimemetics: A Proposed Synthesis of Evolutionary Darwinism, Neuroeconomics, Neurotheology, Behavioral Anthropology and Memetics
Wright synthesized the Epimemetic (Dopameme) Cultural Buoyancy Map and ideology that has spawned an exponentially growing movement, a science, and a philosophy. The science of Epimemetics combines the neurochemistry of dopamine with semantic theory, decision theory (game theory), motivational and behavioral theory, cognitive (bio)neurophysics, neuroeconomics, confabulation theory (blind spot theory), network theory, evolutionary biology, and memetics.
Innovation and insight derived from these converging disciplines could be used to engineer a culturally-determined movement towards pure collaboration, compassion and endless creativity. A byproduct of the process could be a cultural release from general addiction via integrated hypermotivation as a central cultural value propositions. Translation: Every human being is addicted to dopamine, the difference is only how they access, modify, synthesize and elevate dopamine levels inside their own heads. Epimemetics is about putting to good use the "everyday-flood of novelty-seeking-anticipation-generating dopamine" in order to help transform culture. *Special thanks to David Pearce of The Hedonistic Imperative for the original seed ideas on Hypermotivation.
The Epimemetic Stacking Replicator Map (Version 1.0) - Reaching for The Fourth Replicator
The Fourth Replicator Is Pure Creativity (aka The Pattern)
This transfer of cultural values from 'object/material' oriented to 'idea and ideal' oriented' (aka 'Vmeme Containers' in Spiral Dynamics) necessarily includes the utter recalibration of all forms of financial currency and value exchange within the current Mankiwian economic system- which represents a Global Value Fiction held together primarily by the strength of social Memes.
Inevitably, this work will be presented at the TED conference for further collaboration and cultural inception. The philosophy of Epimemetics (which includes the theory of Epimemetic Global Awakening) is perhaps the only evolving integral scientific systems presuming to re-cognize (and if necessary combat and/or absorb) an ever growing army of unconscious neuro-replicators and memes spreading at the Speed-of-Web. (Update: Exception - see The Futurica Trilogy) However, other linear scientific disciplines are beginning to incorporate Epimemetic Theory during the cross-collaboration process. Epimemetics is a collaborative and evolving science of "memetic velocity", synthesis and conscious replication" that draws upon over a dozen scientific disciplines. This emerging science necessarily includes the participation of some of the greatest minds and iconoclasts of our time.
All Along The WatchTower: A Completely Un-Scientific Rant by Epimemetics Founder, Russell Wright
Why Do I Care About Epimemes and the Fourth Replicator?
Technologist Russell Wright Unplugged (Rant - August 2011):
I care about Epimemes because I have spent my life living in cults, sub-cultures and indegenous communities around the world. I have seen the power of ideas, both good and bad, to govern people's choices and to limit their power. Rather than embrace their personal power as a cultural creatives . . . I have seen people that I love succumb to apathy and resign themselves to the inherent limits of a culturally reinforced toxic Meta-Belief.'
"All of this has happened before . . . and all of this will happen again." - BattleStar Galactica (From Caprican Religious Texts)
A Planned Vision of the Fourth Replicator May Be Necessary to Bring About It's Existence . . .
. . . Because the Third Replicator is Probably The Most Dangerous Phase of Cultural Evolution for Any Species
Another reason that I care so much about the Fourth Replicator is that the Third Replicator is probably the most dangerous phase of cultural evolution for any species to undergo. Please see the video by Professor Susan Blackmore for validation on this justified concern. I believe that a planned and co-creative vision of the Fourth Replicator may be both helpful and necessary in order to actualize it's existence.
If you are unclear about the dangers or the Third Replicator (aka technology memes or "Temes") it is best to provide some examples. Science is no-longer fiction. It may be helpful to consider "Temes" as the tech-based Cylon genie 'escaping' from the metaphorical bottle within an evolving culture. This tech genie was released by humans as The Third Replicator (aka Teme) after the Second Replicator of language and belief (aka Meme). This Cylon genie cannot be put back inside Pandora's box once unleashed upon culture. Here are only a few of many examples of Temes-gone-Wild in popular culture today:
1. Self replicating and self-repairing nanotubules that do not require human beings to repair themeselves.
- Purdue creates self-generating nanotubes with 'dial-up' properties.
- Carbon nanotubes in medicine.
- Self-Replicating Carbon Nanotube Fabric
2 Genetically Modified Food and Genetically Engineered Organisms
- Agrobacterium injects T-DNA into plant cells for Genetically Modified Crops - Genie Cannot Be Put Back Into the Bottle
- Transgenic Spider-Goat Hybrids Produce Tougher-Than-Steel Silk
- Genetically Modified Silkworms Spin Super Strong Spider Silk for Bandages and Bulletproof Vests
- Doctor Clones Humans - First Time Ever
3. Artificial Intelligence and Recursive Programming and Recursive Consciousness
- Google funds the Artificial Intelligence "Regret Algorithm" that is Counter Factual Minimization
- The Semantic Web Begins to Replace "Flat" Natural Lanuage Processing
- Wolfram Alpha, The Computational Knowledge Engine is Fully Operational
4. Meme Velocity and Cultural Evolution - Broadcasting and Meme Replication (Accelerated Cultural Replication)
- Google buys Youtube Allowing the Possibility of a Personal Broadcasting Channel for Every Single Human Being on Earth.
- (October 4th, 2012) - Facebook reaches 1.5 Billion Users - increasing Meme and Image-Meme Replication Veclocity towards the speed of light. This transformed cultural evolution forever. Note: Memes have nothing to do necessarily with facts.
- Chris Anderson, Curator of TED Talks, Gives a Groundbreaking Talk on How Video Changes The World Faster
- Steven Johnson Reveals How The Entire Planet Has Become The New Coffee House For Better Memes To Mate and Grow
- Matt Ridley Clarifies How Ideas Mate and Produce (Video: When ideas have sex)
The Third Replicator in Contemporary Science Fiction
- BattleStar Galactica (2003) *Probably the most comprehensive dystopic philosphical contemplation on the "meta" physical possibilities of Artificial Intelligence-gone-wild, ever produced. The entire premise of the new 2003 updated version is a story of a cvilization's Third Replicator unleashed on humans living on a planet called Caprica in a galaxy far far away. From an Epimemetic perspective, the entire series is the story of mankinds struggle to embrace and integrate the 4th replicator (Creative Cultural Collaboration), while literally fleeing from their own 3rd Replicators called The Cylons. Required watching.
- The Terminator (1984) *In 2029, artificially intelligent machines are attempting to exterminate what is left of the human race. Two beings from this era travel back in time to 1984 Los Angeles: One is a Terminator (Arnold Schwarzenegger), a cyborg assassin programmed to kill a woman named Sarah Connor (Linda Hamilton); the other is Kyle Reese (Michael Biehn), a human resistance fighter sent to protect her. Kyle explains that in the near future an artificial intelligence defence network called Skynet will become self-aware and initiate a nuclear holocaust of mankind.
- StarGate SG-1 (2000) *In the military science fiction series Stargate SG-1, the Replicators are antagonistic self-replicating machines that propagate by ingesting the metals that make up civilizations and use them to create either blocks that form the bug-like version or smaller cells that compose the human-form "Replicators". They were first mentioned indirectly in the season 3 episode "Fair Game", and first seen onscreen in "Nemesis". In the show, the Replicators are primarily the enemies of the Asgard race, however, they act like a plague against all life thus, in the series, Earth must also contend with them on several occasions. The Asurans in the spin-off series Stargate Atlantis might be related to those in Stargate SG-1 as they are essentially human-form "Replicators". In the show, Standard Replicators are composed of modular blocks, comparable to individual computers, that come together to perform tasks. According to Thor, the blocks generate a "reactive modulating monopolar energy field" that allows them to self-assemble into various configurations. Each Replicator block contains two million "isolated keron pathways". All Replicators are interconnected via a subspace network. Replicator blocks can assemble into any form needed; the most commonly encountered shape is a small "bug" with four limbs and "wings" on its back. The bug can upgrade itself into a larger "queen" to facilitate replication. Large numbers of Replicators can form into starships, which are first seen in "New Order". In "Enemies", many Replicator bugs assemble into a larger structure to enhance the hyperdrive of a Goa'uld mothership. In Stargate: The Ark of Truth, the Replicators form a skeletal structure that implants into Marrick's body, to gain access to his mind. The Replicator structure continues to function even after Marrick's body is destroyed. The main Replicator directives in the show are to multiply and to assimilate new technologies. Replicators utilize whatever materials are available; in "Small Victories", the Replicators created from a Russian submarine are made of steel and susceptible to rusting. Multiple blocks are required for replication, and the process requires a large amount of energy. Replicators are attracted to the most advanced technologies available, thus they ignore the relatively crude technology of the Earth ship Prometheus in "Unnatural Selection". Replicators adapt very quickly to new technologies and they are capable of enhancing technology they encounter beyond its original specifications.
What is 'The Pattern' (aka The Fourth Replicator) as Described In Epimemetic Philosophy?
"All of this has happened before . . . and all of this will happen again." - BattleStar Galactica (From Caprican Religious Texts)
The Pattern as Toroid:
The Pattern is probably best symbolized as The Toroid or torus. The toroid may have been the First Epimeme within the hydrodynamic fluid of the original universal soup. It was probably the first unifying axiom and force of nature that acted as a unifying force for other axioms. This axiom has relevance across multiple disciplines including but not limited to: mathematics, physics, hydrodynamics, topology and knot theory, novelty theory, sociology, history, memetics, artificial intelligence and cognitive neuroscience - most notably V.S. Ramachandran's theory of recursive embeddedness and consciousness.
The Pattern' (aka The Fourth Replicator) in terms of Cultural Evolution and History:
The Pattern is The Fourth Replicator. Maybe. We don't know yet. Several of us are making guesses. But we can sense something, maybe even imagine something. My deceased friend and mentor Terence Mckenna believed The Fourth Replicator to be The Alien Artificat At The End of Recursive Time. I have my chips on The Fourth Replicator (presuming the human race survives Tech Memes or Temes) as Pure Creativity, Pure Imagination, and Pure Novelty as the New Global Cultural Value Currency. This would be a rather hopeful product of cultural evolution to replace the pure economic value fiction that drives culture today. The pure concept of "The Pattern" was inspired by what Theodore Schwenk called Sensitive Chaos. This is what I mean when I say "The Pattern". This term is intentionally "loaded" or dopaminergic, and this is an intentional element of any new cultural mythology. That being said, I hope that "The Pattern" will crystalize as a cultural fact - preferably in my lifetime.
The Pattern is nature's own fluid dynamic, and her original non-static Epimeme. Buckminster Fuller called it Tensegrity and Integrity. The Pattern is the way that nature uses replication and imitation with slight variation to create new and emerging ideas that are inevitably more stable. If they are NOT stable, they are "spun out of the mix" as kludge. '
The job of exoteric and organized religion is to encourage us keep the The Pattern hidden, even from ourselves. It is almost perfectly designed to prevent us from escaping both the intellectual and spiritual limits of Existential Cognitive Dissonance (ECD).
The irony is that conscious awareness of replication and change- leads to Existential Cognitive Consonance.
But Meta-Beliefs are untouchable, because most people prefer to repress and ignore them.
Certain "loaded" beliefs (Mark Evan Furman calls these 'mental attractor activators'), provide the required dopamine to the striatum, albeit irrationally.
Religious (unflexible or overly flexible) beliefs are programmed into the brain during early childhood and are emotionally charged with dopaminergic associations. These associations become dopattractors (See my wiki entry about Dr. Mark Evan Furman).
If an inaccurate (and potentially dangerous) belief (dopattractor) allows for a momentary inversion of the'Dopaminergic Sysiphus Slope 'created by Existential Cognitive Dissonance, the Meta-Meme can be very difficult, if not impossible, to purge from the neurotheology of the individual addict.
An Epimemetic Awakeing accomplishes exactly such a purge and leads to Existential Cognitive Consonance. It also leads to a crystal clear view of the Moral Landscape (See the work of Epimemetic Hero, Sam Harris). For me personally- it is now very difficult to ignore "The Pattern" of self-replicating ideas in my head or in the minds of others, because they obviously lead to physical manifestation and replication of ideas, objects, people, and smelly cars in my environment. (The combustion engine is first an idea). Meta-beliefs can create the most amazing scientific discoveries and innovations . . . or they can lead to bombs on airplanes . . . but they all share the same source: the human neuromatrix.
I feel obligated to take responsibility for all ideas. My meta-belief about taking personal responsibility is now a core driver- and it changes my behavior. It has a life of it's own, and is an Epimeme (above memes). Such a meta-belief draws large amounts of dopaminergic energy from evolutionary reciprocal altruism (See Alan Fiske) but it is also very selfish, like my genes- because it is still based on survival- and the hope that our species will expand and collaborate with all sentient life in the Universe. Like Gene Roddenberry, I believe that human beings have amazing potential, and an amazing ability to adapt. I believe in our collective ability to reach far beyond the stars and even transcend the inner and outer Matrix of Epimemetic N-Dimensional Hyperspace. In that sense, I am truly "Awake" to my inevitable participation in perpetuating bad and good things on this planet while I am here rather briefly. Every time I open my mouth I run the risk of replicating a rumor or false idea. Every purchase I make, I am supporting one idea or another. An Epimemetic Awakening simply means that I am spontaneously and naturally obliged to participate with Life by taking responsibility for my replications personally, financially socially and culturally. Such non-religious and non-moralistic accountability is probably the natural evolution of the species at this accelerated time in history- and I really have no choice in the matter. I am hoping that culture at large will adopt the Epimemetic Manifesto, because we would inevitably have a better world. Terence Mckenna described such inevitable cultural novelty and growth as TimeWave Zero. Alexandar Bard (and friends) call it Syntheism. Yeah . . . it's kinda like that . . . ".
Growing List of Epimemetic Heros and Visionary Thought Leaders (Who Strongly Influenced Wright's Thinking about Epimemetics):
Idea Provenance and Meme-Provenance is important to the ethics and evolving collaborative value system of Epimemetics. To the following people and their meme-plexes - thank you for impacting my life in a positive and integrated way. There are many more names to be added in the upcoming months, so if I forgot you, look out, you will listed soon.
The following authors and iconoclasts are the most significant contributors to the evolving discipline of Epimemetics:
Core Epimemetic Axiom:
Susan Blackmore (Founder of Memetic Theory)
(Additional Resources - Not yet listed in any order of importance):
Neuroscientists, Neuropolicy Visionaries and Neurophilosophers:
Gregory S Berns: (His book on dopamine (Satisfaction) inspired us to consider the possibility of Dopamemetics)
Carol Tavris: (Her book "Mistakes Were Made, But Not By Me" has probably saved hundreds, if not thousands, of convicts from being falsely inprisoned or even executed on death row)
Sam Harris (Author of The Moral Landscape)
Mark Evan Furman
Dan Gilbert (Stumbling Upon Happiness)
Derren Brown (Illusionist, Trickster, Magician, NLP Master and Skeptic)
Memetics, Cultural Anthropology and Storytelling
Susan Blackmore (Founder of Memetic Theory, a philosophy that draws on Richard Dawkins The Selfish Gene)
Richard Brodie (Richard's book 'Virus of the Mind' on how memes influence culture is a difinitive book for the layman)
Clare Graves (Creator of the original Spiral Dynamic System - a valiant attempt to quantify meme-plexes and Vmeme containers)
Steven Johnson (Video: Where good ideas come from)
Robert Greene: (Author of the 48 Laws of Power)
Ph.D. Paul Pearsall (Author of Toxic Success)
Technology Philosophers and Temetic Visionaries
Contrarian Physicists and Cultural Creatives
Contrarian Health Thinkers
(Old Archives) Early Epimemetics Videos by Wright that Probably Should Not Have Been Published
Epigentics, Epimemetics, and Dopamemetics (Putting it all together, a Spontaneous Whiteboard Talk by Russell Wright) Warning and Disclaimer:
Outdated! Please note that these talks are spontaneous inprovisations created at the dawn of Epimemetics, and will probably be archived shortly. They were designed as a mere introduction to Epimemetic Cultural Buoyancy.
They are currently theoretical at best.
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 1:
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 2:
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 3:
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 4:
(The Future of Motivation and Memes)
(The Future of Pleasure)
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 5
(The Future of Motivation and Memes)
(The Future of Pleasure)
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 6
(The Future of Motivation and Memes)
(The Future of Pleasure)
The Future of The Future: Unmapping the Web Part 7
Your Epimemetic Awakening
Every major esoteric tradition on earth has served the function of attempting to help the individual to gain control of their mirror neurons and become individual Iconoclasts.
If you do not accomplish this while alive, the Replicators Really Are In Charge:
(More Coming Soon)- stay tuned because this concept is HUGE!)